The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by civil rights activist and podcaster DeRay Mckesson to discuss a plan he and his team at Campaign Zero have been working on to systematically reform police departments to combat police brutality. They discuss how the use of recently obtained data, education, and smart solutions can help bring about these changes (3:45). Then, Steve Kerr and Pete Carroll are joined by San Antonio Spurs head coach Gregg Popovich to have a conversation about the state of our nation, how we got here as a country, our absence of leadership, and how we can take action to grow and bring about change following the killing of George Floyd by a Minneapolis police officer (46:17). Here are links to resources that DeRay recommends podcast listeners explore: joincampaignzero.org policescorecard.org checkthepolice.org Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices